A Non-Christian’s Attempt at Helping Christians Learn How to Convert
October 29, 2007
I am becoming increasingly perplexed at the concept of conversion, and man’s role in the matter. I know Jesus gave the great commission to “go and make disciples,” and I get that. I also know that when the day of Pentecost came, it was through the “Holy Spirit,” not the preaching of Peter, that people were converted. I also know that Paul spent a good amount of time evangelizing to the Greeks in the book of Romans. I also know that only God can soften hearts (or harden them in the case of Exodus) that people may come to him…for we are all dead in sin.
Do you see where I’m going with this? What is the role of the person in conversion? I wrote an earlier article on the point of apologetics, where I determined that apologetics is really for the believer, not the unbeliever. Intellectual arguments are not going to convert me back to Christianity, just as intellectual arguments are not likely to deconvert someone out of Christianity, or any other religion.
I have had several cases of people quoting scripture to me as comments on my blog, trying to show me the error of my ways. They are good-hearted, wanting to help, but also knowing I am headed straight to hell. Well, here’s the deal. QUOTING SCRIPTURE TO NON-CHRISTIANS IS NOT GOING TO WORK! Sorry to yell at the reader, but I think this needs to be clearly understood. Christians, please do not quote scripture to me as a means of trying to get me “saved” again. It won’t work. Why? Because my eyes are darkened, my heart is hardened, and unless the Holy Spirit moves in me, I don’t have a chance of escaping hell. (Not to mention the fact that I don’t accept the bible as divinely inspired…you might as well quote Homer to me).
I am being a little tongue and cheek here. I’m really not trying to be rude, but I do think it’s important for Christians to realize that you are not going to save people through comments on a blog. If you truly want to save someone, you have to play a significant role in that person’s life. You have to make sure that you are living the life appropriately, and that it’s attractive enough for the convert-to-be to want to accept that life. You, Christians, are not going to save anyone. The best you can do is listen, explain your position (apologetics), and then get out of the way. If you truly believe with all your heart that God is the one responsible for saving and changing lives, please let him do it.
I have nothing against the bible. I do not hold it to be divinely inspired, but I do think it serves a purpose. I don’t mind people quoting scripture in a comment on my blog as long as it’s relevant to our discussion. But please refrain from meaningless banter about my needing to read the bible and quoting the “truth” to me. There are more effective and loving ways to reach people.
October 29, 2007 at 2:52 pm
did you mean that all written in the bible is not inspired by GOD? GIVE AN SPECIFIC VERSES THAT YOU THAT BELIEVE SO THAT WE CAN DISCUSS IT..
MY FRIEND…
October 29, 2007 at 2:53 pm
FIRST OF ALL PARDON ME IF MY ENGLISH IF WRONG GRAMMAR.. BECAUSE I AM FILIPINO…
October 29, 2007 at 2:56 pm
I MEAN THAT YOU DO NOT BELIEVE… GIVE ME AN SPECIFIC VERSES
October 29, 2007 at 3:03 pm
MAYBE NEXT time AGAIN .. BECAUSE ITS ALREADY 3AM here in the Phillipines.. i have not sleep yet.. till next time my Friend!
GOD BLESS YOU!
October 31, 2007 at 8:42 am
JAN MICHAEL LACHICA; perhaps condensing your items into one post would be more appropriate.
Religious conversion could be seen as a hostile attack, a way of changing another’s beliefs by hammering down their psychological resistance. In such a sense, is it really then such an achievement when the individual finally capitulates and agrees to follow your faith?
Surely the mere fact that you had to convince them in the first place is enough to justify their exclusion from the group; they don’t intrinsically believe in your ideas so why bother expending so much energy in the conversion process?
The matter boils down to group assimilation. Religion has been group-psychology’s biggest success story, at least in spreading itself amoung minds. Thus, the motivation for conversion comes from such dynamics as creating a larger group than your neighbour; with size comes power. Those that cannot be defeated via physical means are instead attacked psychologically. This subterfuge seeks to sneak in through the back doors of our defenses, offering false yet appealing explainations to our human need for making sense of the world.
Conversion seems an entirely emotional affair. Fear and to an extent, potential bliss for the follower, are dangled infront of the convertee like a carrot in front of the donkey. It is only in recent times that relgion is starting to open itself to the intellectual arena; intelligent design is one example. I believe religion is adapting to the rising education of society and countering it by changing (and softening) the beliefs that it once preached as gospel.
I agree with your conclusion MJ, if religion is to make an effective conversive force and appeal to the intellectuals, it needs to move away from purely emotional and irrational beliefs. Humanists need a belief system that offers potential for growth, as well as a focus on the here and now, rather than some mythical afterlife.
Please Christians, don’t insult humanity’s intelligence by stubbornly clinging to beliefs that were long ago outdated. Instead, look how you can change your religion to act as a proactive force that does REAL good in the world, rather than taking away people’s responsibility, free-will and natural inquisitiveness.
October 31, 2007 at 9:21 am
IM JUST CONCERN TO OTHERS! BECAUSE MOST OF YOU ATHEIST… SPREADING IN THE BLOG A VERY FOOL BELIEVEF…
THAT GOD DOEST EXIST… THATS WHY MOST OF THE ATHEIST ARE AFRAID TO DO EVIL.. BECAUSE THEY NOT BELIEVE JUDGEMENT DAY …!
The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Corrupt are they, and have done abominable iniquity; There is none that doeth good.
Psalms 53:1
Plsss Stop Poisoning others mind
October 31, 2007 at 9:22 am
i mean are NOT AFRAID TO DO EVIL MOST OF THE ATHEIST!
October 31, 2007 at 10:10 am
Jan Michael,
To me, poisoning of the mind happens when one accepts something as serious as religion without examination. Examination is what is happening on this blog as well as Vulcanis’. The whole point of our blogs is to look at issues from various viewpoints, and the point of the comments section is for others to agree or disagree. If you disagree with examining your beliefs, I can’t help you.
Vulcanis,
Once again, very well stated. After reviewing your comments, it occurred to me that I might be using the wrong word. Perhaps, with deference to the rest of the post, I should have used the word “Evangelization” instead. I’m not sure.
October 31, 2007 at 10:50 am
by the way do you know what is the meaning of RELIGION ? you better study first… aroud you.. for you to understand that all things here ..is not by accident.. for your info.. all branches of science is in the bible and the prophecy of it we can see the Fullfillment now…
that is the last day:
But know this, that in the last days grievous times shall come.
For men shall be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, haughty, railers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy ,
without natural affection, implacable, slanderers, without self-control, fierce, no lovers of good ,traitors, headstrong, puffed up, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God;
and this was written 2,000yrs ago
Like Jesus Christ said 2,000yrs ago
And ye shall hear of wars and rumors of wars; see that ye be not troubled: for these things must needs come to pass; but the end is not yet.For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom; and there shall be famines and earthquakes in divers places.
Matthew 24:6-7
it was written before it happen for us to believed
And now I have told you before it come to pass, that, when it is come to pass, ye might believe.
John 14:29
and ATHEIST also one of the Fullfillment on what the bible prophesied..
For the time will come when they will not endure the sound doctrine; but, having itching ears, will heap to themselves teachers after their own lusts;
II Timothy 4:3
BUT ITS NOT TO LATE MY FRIEND!
DONT GET OFFENDED OF ME
October 31, 2007 at 10:54 am
I’m not offended, but every age has believed we are in the “last days.” History is full of examples of people committing suicide, selling all their possessions, waiting on mountain tops etc… for Christ to return. If it happens during my lifetime, I will gladly admit my mistake.
October 31, 2007 at 11:22 am
To be frank to you my friend… first of all its to difficult for me to construct an english dialect.. because im just High school graduate but even though im just 21yrs old thers whithin me.. arging me to write or to post something..
as you have that
“History is full of examples of people committing suicide, selling all their possessions, waiting on mountain tops etc… for Christ to return.”
i agree to that!now why? it because they not understand what jesus Christ said they miss understood the verses… it is real that we on the last day now but .. what jesus prophesied it will happen slowly..like we see now…
to be Honest to you thers One left not yet happen.. and after that ..end comes
THE GREAT TRIBULATIONS it not yet Happen.. but to now we can see slowly by slowly it happen..
now if we see already the whole prophcy of christ
its already the end..
for then shall be great tribulation, such as hath not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, nor ever shall be.And except those days had been shortened, no flesh would have been saved: but for the elect’s sake those days shall be shortened.
Matthew 24:21-22
but i pray FOR YOU MY FRIEND
GOD BLESS YOU..! even though you dont believe him..
THANK YOU!
November 1, 2007 at 7:57 am
As God is wise, He uses people to communicate His salvation to people. He is too glorious to speak face to face with people. and if He uses animals or beings of lower class, these will never be more credible than people to be believed by them. however, you have a point.i believe exchange of words is not the only way bring others to the light that is why our God commanded us to let our light shine before men that they may see our good deeds and glorify our Father in heaven.
Matthew 5:16 Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.
Philippians 2:16 Holding forth the word of life; that may rejoice in the day of Christ, that I have not run in vain, neither labored in vain.
besides, the essence of the religion that God teaches is holiness and charity.
James 1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this,To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.
But of course, as we need basis in almost all our undertakings in life, our faith should also have a credible basis. scientifically and logically sound… as a country needs laws and constitutions to ensure harmony and to give equal and due punishment to violators, so must the people of God. we need to know what is good and what is bad so that we cannot blame Him for not telling us. so God, as wise and loving as He is, gave us the Holy Bible whose truth is supported by science, archaeology, and other branches of knowledge.and this truth must be known by men because God wills that all men be saved and come to come to the knowledge of truth. so there came a need for people who will speak God’s truth.
romans 10:17, 14-15
“So then faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the word of God. how then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? and how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, how beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things.
furthermore, Christians are not commanded to force people to believe. but we will do our part to share our faith. take it or leave it!
ezekiel 3:17:19 “Son of man, I have made thee a watchman unto the house of Israel:therefore hear the word at my mouth, and give them warning from me. when I say unto the wicked thou shalt surely die; and thou givest him not warning, nor speakest to warn the wicked from his wicked way, to save his life; the same wicked man shall die in his iniquity; but his blood will I require at thine hand. yet if thou warn the wicked, and he turn not from his wickedness, nor from his wicked way, he shall die in his iniquity; but thou hast delivered thy soul.
may God show you the way and renew a right spirit within you.
please visit http://www.esoriano.wordpress.com
sincerely,
beth
November 6, 2007 at 7:10 pm
The central theme of the Bible is God’s love for you and for all people. This love was revealed when Jesus Christ, the Son of God, came into the world as a human being, lived a sinless life, died on the cross, and rose from the dead. Because Christ died, your sins can be forgiven, and because He conquered death you can have eternal life. You can know for sure what will become of you after you die.
You have probably heard the story of God’s love referred to as the “Gospel.” The word Gospel simply means “Good News.” The Gospel is the Good News that, because of what Christ has done, we can be forgiven and can live forever.
But this gift of forgiveness and eternal life cannot be yours unless you willingly accept it.
“Here I am! I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears my voice and opens the door, I will come in and eat with him, and he with me.” —Revelation 3:20 (NIV)
Jesus Christ wants to have a personal relationship with you. Picture, if you will, Jesus Christ standing at the door of your heart (the door of your emotions, intellect and will). Invite Him in; He is waiting for you to receive Him into your heart and life.
December 5, 2008 at 2:58 pm
Only YOU will stand before God, your Creator,one day. No one to blame.
Did you recieve Him or not when you were drawn by the Holy Spirit? No one can save you. They can only be His mouthpiece, but only you can be saved by answering YES to His Loving Holy Spirit. You are without excuse.
Ask God and get answers about Him yourself. Don’t rely upon other people. He will speak directly to you. He Loves You!
October 19, 2009 at 3:49 pm
I recently came across your blog while researching humanism and deism. I really appreciate your point of view. I don’t understand how people could read this post and still do exactly what you asked them not to.